[Trent Miller]

I don't consider it work. I consider it more of the fun aspect of it. You're absolutely still learning something, so I guess it could tie back into work as well then.

[Kyser Clark]

I see what you're saying, so you don't look at it as a professional relationship, you look at it as like a genuine friendship.

[Trent Miller]

It's a refreshing feeling in my opinion, it's getting to chat with people about the topics that you like, or maybe you get to talk to somebody who's a little bit more advanced in what they do and learn some really cool things. I got to talk to some really cool other pen testers who taught me about some of the things that they do and some ideas that I can take out of that and start applying to my own tests.

[Kyser Clark]

Welcome to The Hacker's Cache, the show that decrypts the secrets of cybersecurity one byte at a time. I'm your host, Kyser Clark, and today I have a returning guest, Trent Miller, also known as AzureAD. He is a pen tester, security researcher, and one of the founding members of DC608, the DEF CON group in Madison, Wisconsin, with over a decade of IT experience spanning roles in system engineering, administration, and vulnerability management.

Trent has built a diverse foundation that fuels his offense security expertise, and he has held key positions at Tenable, contributed to vulnerability management practices, and earned his OSCP along the way. Today, Trent blends professional penetration testing with community leadership, helping others break into and advance within cybersecurity. And if you're wondering what episode he was on previously, it was episode number 20, and that was actually the most viewed episode last season.

So congrats, Trent, for having the most viewed episode. That was a very special episode because that was episode 21. For those who don't know, I started with episode zero, so when I say 20, it's really 21.

And that 21 is a special number because that was when you break in the top 1% of podcasts. And yeah, my mic was messed up in that one. It's not messed up in this one.

So if you go back and watch that one, please forget the mic. But Trent, thank you so much for coming back on the show. What have you been up to since last time you was on the Hackers Cash podcast?

[Trent Miller]

Well, first off, thank you for having me back. I am currently a penetration tester and security consultant with GoScale. I do everything from physical pen testing to wireless, internal, external.

I just have a wide variety of things that I do. And I have been doing that alongside my regular practice that I've been doing for the last five or six years now.

[Kyser Clark]

Nice. So one of the things we talked about in the last time you was on the show, episode number 20, was work-life balance. We talked about how the OSCP sacrifices is real.

And I think that's one of the reasons why that episode got so much attention. And now I'm wondering, now that you've broken into your first pen testing role, you got your OSCP, what does work-life balance look like for you now that you are in an established position?

[Trent Miller]

Absolutely more balanced. I can say that it is very rare to run into circumstances where I am going to be putting in too much more work into what I do day-to-day. So of course, with any job, there's always a little bit of overtime.

If you need a project done, absolutely going to have to step in and do that. But I can say that it's been very good, very good to me.

[Kyser Clark]

So I have a, there might be something wrong with me, but one of my, my last, last stream I did, I was talking about like how there's no work-life balance, even if you're already in the field. And the reason why I think that is because in a nutshell, it's, I'm basically saying like, if you don't level up, like the people behind you are going to catch up and take your job and AI is going to take your job. And, and maybe that's a little, maybe that's searching the truth a little bit, but I feel like if I'm not grinding even today, and I am a, I'm in a quote unquote, a secure position at my company, but I still, I'm putting in like stupid amounts of hours and other certifications.

Yeah. What do you think about that? Do you think like I got the wrong mentality or like, I have a feeling you have the opposite mentality with, with that, like putting in a grind after work, but yeah, like, what do you think about that?

And when it comes to like level up your career, like how do you keep a balance and still level up at the same time?

[Trent Miller]

I guess for myself, I find myself more or less agreeing with the idea of grinding, but maybe, maybe in smaller bursts instead of, instead of running myself ragged every single day instead, I will sit down and put in a good long weekend, or I'll put in a week of efforts over the course of the evening hours. Maybe I'll put in, you know, two, three hours doing something related to the field, maybe not directly correlating to what I'm doing day to day, but definitely stuff that'll help me kind of keep that understanding going, keep that train of thought going. But I think the biggest thing I've been doing recently is stepping back from the job and picking up this pieces where maybe I feel like there's gaps in my knowledge, instead of necessarily dumping all of my effort into a new cert or putting all of my effort into more advanced things I know, I'll instead go back and say, oh, I've missed this during a pen test recently.

How can I improve this? Or I really don't understand how these tools interact with EDR. How can I go ahead and figure that out myself in my own home lab? So I definitely understand where you're coming from with the, the grinding really hard, but I tend to like to keep it a little more enjoyable and a little more calm to not burn myself out.

[Kyser Clark]

Yeah. And when I said, I think there's something wrong with me. So the reason why I said that is because I try to take a break.

I really did. Like I was like getting off work. I was playing video games for like four hours a day after work and just chilling, dude, just chilling, relaxing.

And honestly, it stressed me out more than when I was grinding, because I think for me, I have to feel like I am accomplishing something meaningful. And I don't feel like I'm accomplishing anything when I'm playing a video game, like trying to enjoy life because it's not really helped my career or anything. So I don't know.

I feel like when I take a break, it burns me out more. And when I work harder, I like the, the achievements fuels me. So I wish I could take a break.

I really do. But the work life balance, it's a tricky situation. And I guess it's, it's different for everybody.

So one thing I've been kind of thinking about is like work life balance is different for everybody. So like, if you see someone doing one thing, like for example, like, Oh yeah, I see someone like chilling and going to the park or going to the beach. And like, that's how they refuel.

Like I tried that and it doesn't work. So I guess the moral story is here is like, you got to try different things if you're, if you feel burned out.

[Trent Miller]

Yeah, absolutely. I agree with you. It's all about your own perspective.

Not everyone can be ready to put in so many extra hours. But also once you're to the point where you need to be, you'll feel comfortable rather than feeling like you're stressed, trying to get ahead of the game. Because to be honest, once you learn, once you feel like you've learned everything, you probably are already behind anyway.

So it's always best to kind of balance. It's a, it's a large balancing act and you need to learn where you fit best. I believe.

[Kyser Clark]

Yeah, that makes sense. So what are some of the areas you're trying to improve in your pen testing work? So you said like, you try to focus on things that you miss, but like, how do you know you miss them?

[Trent Miller]

So it kind of comes down to when I, when I say miss, I'm kind of bringing, bringing the idea of, well, I missed out on an opportunity that I think I could have done. Or I missed out on being able to utilize this, you know, machine or I was able to, or this exploit and kind of just the different ideas that I could have created off of the knowledge that I had. But also trying to find ways to alternate ways to do those, to do different actions that maybe won't trigger EDR, because that seems to be something that I constantly run into now.

Or maybe I realized later on that I never retested this group of user accounts that I had, those kinds of things that just really feel like you could have been improving, improving your processes or improving your methodology. It's just kind of how I've been taking it in. So anything that I feel that was not whole, and I'll say, I'll take up the time to relearn, or I'll go over new methods to do it.

[Kyser Clark]

Okay. Yeah. That's, that's really good to know.

Before we dive further into conversation, we're going to have to do security Mad Libs. So Trent, are you ready for security Mad Libs?

[Trent Miller]

I am.

[Kyser Clark]

So audience, for those who are new to the show, Trent will have 40 seconds to answer five security Mad Libs. If he does all five Mad Libs in 40 seconds or less, he'll get a bonus six Mad Lib that's unrelated to cybersecurity. His time will start as soon as I stop asking the first question.

So Trent, are you ready?

[Trent Miller]

Yep.

[Kyser Clark]

Trent, the one command I type without thinking is?

[Trent Miller]

Ls.

[Kyser Clark]

The one time I totally fumbled during an engagement was when?

[Trent Miller]

I forgot to reuse a user's password.

[Kyser Clark]

The most confusing log I've ever read said? I'm sorry, what'd you say? The most confusing log I've ever read said?

[Trent Miller]

Null.

[Kyser Clark]

The weirdest device I hacked was a?

[Trent Miller]

A printer.

[Kyser Clark]

I once fixed a vulnerability by?

[Trent Miller]

Changing a password.

[Kyser Clark]

38 seconds. Nice. Good.

Congratulations. So we'll just go right on the bonus. And the bonus, you can explain as much as or as low as you want to.

You can even dodge it entirely. Here's a bonus. The world wasn't ready for what?

The internet. The internet. Why do you think that?

If you don't mind me asking, I mean, you can leave it a mystery. You can just leave it one word if you want.

[Trent Miller]

Because it's consumed everyone and everything.

[Kyser Clark]

Yeah, you're right. I mean, the internet was one of the most groundbreaking things of all time, for sure. And it's changed the entire world for better and for worse.

And there's definitely cons to the internet. But I think the pros outweigh the cons, in my opinion. But it just depends on what type of person you are.

There's like just people that are obviously abusing the internet for nefarious purposes. But there's also people who are abusing themselves by consuming the wrong type of content on the internet. So it's a double-edged sword for sure.

[Trent Miller]

Absolutely.

[Kyser Clark]

For me, when I think of that question, I think of AI. And I know it's like a buzzword. People think it's a buzzword.

But I think you hear it all the time. And people are like, oh yeah, AI. But I think so many people are just ignoring it too much.

I know in our field, we're talking about it a lot as cybersecurity professionals and aspiring cybersecurity professionals. But the average person isn't thinking about AI that much. And those people, I hate to say it, and I've said it before and I'll say it again, but there's going to be a lot of people losing jobs over AI.

And they don't even know it yet. And I think that's, it's taken the world by storm. It already has, and it will continue to do so in the future, in my opinion.

And I think people who are ignoring it, they are going to have short careers and there will be negative effects of that. So if you're listening and watching, my recommendation is not to sleep on AI. Because I think a lot of people are, and I know it pops up a lot and people are talking about it a lot.

And it is a buzzword, but it's a buzzword that is actually a thing.

[Trent Miller]

Yeah. I have to say it, well, it isn't perfect at everything. There are things that I believe you should understand about it as a pen tester.

Even as a defender, absolutely should learn about it and utilize it when you can. But obviously another area is don't completely rely on it either. I think a lot of people need to be reminded that it is still in its infancy.

It is still building. It'll take some time before it's perfected for sure.

[Kyser Clark]

Oh yeah, for sure. Yeah. You can't blindly trust it.

I've definitely been given wrong information from AI. And a lot of people, they're like, oh yeah, AI can get stuff wrong. Of course you can get stuff wrong.

But so can a person. So can the top expert in the field can get things wrong. Does that mean that they're not an expert anymore?

Does it mean if you get some bad information from someone that really knows their stuff, are you never going to go to them again for mentorship or advice or whatever it may be? And I think people who like, oh yeah, I can get stuff wrong. Let's just never use them.

Like, oh, that's, that's a little excessive in my opinion. Cause I, I personally have seen ChattyBT. I use ChattyBT.

That's my main one. Um, actually it's the only one I really use. I've dabbled in a couple other ones, but I just, I always think ChattyBT is best for what I'm using it for.

And, uh, I've definitely seen him give me some bad information. And I've also seen him give me some advice and some recommendations that I have rejected because you're, you have to be willing to reject what it says sometimes. It's not, uh, like you said, it's not the end all be all, but I think it does.

It's a, it's a nice aid. The way you have to treat it, in my opinion, is you have to treat it like you're the expert and, and it's intern. That's the way I look at it.

It's just an assistant. That's all it is. And you have to double check the work and it can cut down some workload, but yeah, you're, you're the expert and it's the intern.

[Trent Miller]

Yeah, absolutely. That is a great way to put it.

[Kyser Clark]

So your most interesting response from the security Mad Libs, you said the one time I totally fumbled during an engagement was when you forgot to reuse a password. So can you talk about that? Yeah.

[Trent Miller]

So, um, the, this pen test I was working on for about a week and a half at this point, I had, uh, been in this in, inside the network for roughly about three or four days. And I had slowly been collecting password hashes using some various methods like relaying. Um, and these, sometimes you'll catch some, uh, administrator accounts or you'll catch some, uh, regular user accounts, but the end goal was just to not start with any credentials and kind of work my way up at this point.

And I had captured probably around 50% of the company at this point, it was pretty small network. And as I started cracking passwords, I was running complex lists and, and different rules. And I had cracked a good section of accounts.

Um, it turns out that I had in the five passwords that I had, I had these, some of these users were reusing each other's passwords as their own. And I only found out about this later after recracking passwords using the list that I had the five or so I had done. And one of them was a domain administrator.

So there, there, there is the, there's the reason why that I answered that one that way.

[Kyser Clark]

Yeah. I would, uh, be kicking myself in that situation too. Yeah.

I think for me, the biggest fumble I've ever had on a pen test was I reported a false positive to the client and the client was like, this isn't a finding. And then I went back and I'm like, Oh yeah, you're right. This isn't a finding.

And I felt like at that moment, I'm like, these guys will never trust me again. Like every, all these other findings I found, they, they don't even matter because, and that was, that was one of the biggest fumbles I've ever had. And, uh, yeah.

So if you write something on a report, like it better, you need a triple check to make sure that's like actually legitimate.

[Trent Miller]

Absolutely. Yeah. Uh, that is a very unfortunate, uh, finding, especially when the customer is your source of income.

[Kyser Clark]

Yes.

[Trent Miller]

Yeah.

[Kyser Clark]

So, you know, lessons learned, you know, so no one's perfect. And, uh, sometimes the best way to learn stuff is the hard way.

[Trent Miller]

Absolutely.

[Kyser Clark]

So one thing we thought about on the last time he was on was your, uh, DefCon group. And you said you was one of the founding members and we didn't really, didn't really dive into, I just basically in passing my, Hey, how can someone join if they want to join? But what I want to know is, and the reason why I want to know is because someone gave me the idea to do this and I'm considering doing this myself.

So this is for your response. This will be for both me and the audience, uh, which most questions are. Um, so you founded your DefCon group and I want to know what made you, what prompted you to, to start that DefCon group.

And then after you decided to do it, like how hard was it to actually create it and get it going?

[Trent Miller]

All right. So I'll actually clarify this a little bit. I was not actually one of the founders.

Um, I will actually give that over to, um, uh, the losing edge and, um, uh, his wife, uh, were actually the founders of DC 608 or the DefCon group, Madison. Um, I was, I came in, um, at the very beginning. Um, and I started offering my help in building the group up to where kind of where we're now helping promote it, helping, um, you know, build up the discord, get things rolling with, um, the, uh, other after meeting, uh, activities like our blue team night, our red team night.

Um, and now we have a coding night. Uh, so we have all these little things that, that needed to be done. And I helped build that.

Whereas the founders, um, they, they did all of the hard work. So I, I came in to kind of, uh, more or less, uh, reap the rewards after that and start helping build up that. Uh, but I did, I'll admit, I did consider creating it, um, but never got around doing it to it.

And, uh, they actually beat me to it.

[Kyser Clark]

Well, I mean, even if you didn't lay the foundation, you still build out the walls. So I still think that's pretty cool for you to do. Um, but yeah, so what, I mean, what kind of advice would you give someone who wanted to start up one or even someone who was in exact shoes, use like someone, um, they're joining a DEF CON group.

That's just started. It's, it's like a dry desert. There's no one coming to the, to the events.

Like, what would you recommend to like help build that up and get an, like a legitimate community started?

[Trent Miller]

Yeah. So I think the biggest thing, um, with building any group is, um, reaching out to other people nearby in the industry. Um, you have so many online tools, LinkedIn, sometimes you have Facebook groups, even, uh, there are a lot of other, um, uh, IT based groups as well, who might be of interest, um, to talk to, to see if they want to come and join you as well.

So definitely reach out, branch out, um, while security is your focus, definitely talk to the other people who maybe aren't security focused because you might garner some interest in, from other people in those groups to help you build them further. Um, structure is obviously really important in the early stages of anything. Start building up, um, your people that you trust to, to help you, um, lead and help, uh, designate roles to everyone so they can start building, helping build up the, uh, the infrastructure that you'll eventually, um, continue building on, I guess.

So making sure that they have the right tools that they need to get their voice out, um, setting up, you know, maybe some smaller meetings, uh, maybe some non-technical things. Like, I think one of the big reasons I joined this group was they did a, um, picnic type outing for their very first meeting. And that, that gave, got me interested.

I got to go out there. They had a meetup.com link, went out there, got to have, um, some food, got to have some drinks, got to chat with people in the industry. Now, not everyone stuck around, but that was like my entry point into the group.

Then I started helping kind of build from there. So I think getting involved with other groups is a huge thing. Um, utilize your online tools.

That'll get you a lot further.

[Kyser Clark]

Yeah, that makes sense. So when you go to these events, like what, what can someone expect at a DEF CON group? Cause I mean, I went to like the main DEF CON, but I'd never been to like a, one of those smaller groups.

Is it, um, I mean, how much different is it from a regular DEF CON? And like, what can you expect in, in a smaller DEF CON group like that?

[Trent Miller]

So for the DEF CON groups, I think, um, it's going to vary. Um, each one is going to probably run a little bit differently, but it seems that the, um, majority do a type of style, um, uh, of talk kind of similar to what maybe like a DEF CON, uh, talk would be, um, getting up, talking to everybody about something that's interesting. Um, maybe you stream it, maybe you don't, those kinds of things.

Uh, sometimes like our group and I've, I've heard other groups do this. We'll do like, um, they'll do like hack the box teams, or like for me, I do like a red team night. Other places do something similar where they'll get together and they'll, they'll work through challenges together or work through a CTF together.

So it, it, it, it wildly varies, but I think that the main thing is just camaraderie, you know, getting together, um, and getting to hear some awesome topics. Maybe you wouldn't have heard otherwise, or maybe you get to hear talk that you missed at a recent convention somewhere else. So great opportunities all around though.

[Kyser Clark]

And so you're talking about work life balance earlier, and I want to tie this back into that for a moment. So, I mean, obviously putting your effort, time and effort and energy into your DEF CON group, um, that's taken out time out of your day, which I guess could potentially lead to the burnout because it's like, you're kind of roping in your career, um, and it's taken away from your purpose in life. But like, how does it, how does like going to the DEF CON groups or, and being active in a community like that, how does it play a part in that work life balance?

Is it, um, make it better? Because it's, because for me, when I went to DEF CON, I realized like, oh, because I was sort of getting burned out because I felt alone. But then when I went to DEF CON, my energy just went through the roof because I realized like, there was a lot of people like me.

And even though I'm not seeing them every day, they're, they're there. And, but so after I got off from DEF CON, I was, I guess, more passionate about the field. So would you say that's the same, like, like being around this like-minded people helps with the burnout or you have a different take on that?

[Trent Miller]

I would say it's like getting together with a group of friends that you all have something very in common together. It's, it's a refreshing feeling, in my opinion, is getting to chat with people about the topics that you like, or maybe you get to talk to somebody who is a little bit more advanced in what they do and learn some really cool things. I've, I have talked, like I went, I was at the, our event last night, um, cause we do it the first Thursday of every month.

I went there and I got to talk to some really cool pen, other pen testers who taught me about some, um, of the things that they do and some ideas that I can take out of that and start applying to my own tests, or maybe, um, something that I can look out for the next time I get involved with something. So it's, it's, it's really refreshing. It, I don't consider it work.

I consider it more of the, um, the, uh, the, uh, fun aspect of it. So, and you're absolutely still learning something. So I guess it could tie back into work as well then.

[Kyser Clark]

I see what you're saying. So you don't look at it as like a professional relationship. You look at it as like a genuine friendship.

Yeah. Pretty close. Okay.

Yeah. That, that, that makes a lot of sense because, you know, I went to, to DEF CON and I'm like, dude, I'm making friends. I didn't, I didn't really expect that to happen.

Like, I was like, Oh yeah. Cause like my mentality going in was, yeah, I'm, I'm here for professional networking. But then I go there, I'm like, Oh, I think I'm making like real friends in real life.

Like, this is weird. So I could see that for sure. Yeah.

So one thing that I've been thinking about a lot is going from professional to expert. It's like on the front of my mind every single day. Like I have a burning passion just to level up.

What are you doing to level up right now? Like you said, you wasn't doing certifications, but I guess I want to know, like, why not go for more certifications? And where do you think the best bang for your buck in terms of like time, effort, energy, if someone's trying to go from someone in the field, maybe they've been in for a handful of years and they're trying to become like an actual like expert that, I say expert, like I'm talking about like really good technical skills and, and even soft skills, like someone that's just a lot of people will look up to, like, what do you think is the best way to do that?

[Trent Miller]

So the way I'm kind of approaching it myself is going off of areas where I feel like I can go further. If there's something that I know well, but maybe I want to know more, I definitely take that opportunity to keep learning that topic. I'll go to try hack me.

I'll go to hack the box. You know, I'll try to find linked and appropriate methods to learn those kinds of things. While I may not be going for technical certifications right now, it is still in my sights at some point to go for more.

But for right now, I'm kind of at a, at a halt for that. While I focus on maybe some non, some technical nature things, but not directly associated with the certification. So if I want to go learn something, I'm going to go learn it.

I'm going to pick it up. If I hear about something really cool, I definitely am one of those types of people that I'll go jump in and take a look at it. I'm really active listening wise in the try hack me discord.

I like listening to what they're like, they're posting about, and sometimes I'll jump onto their site and take a look at some of the newer challenges. But definitely still, I'm still working on different challenges, working on hack the box. I still do that regularly.

And that's also how I do my red team nights too. I will often do the hack the box and then I'll go teach other people on the methodology on how to do that. So I'm still learning, but I'm also teaching what I'm learning too.

So I continue to just work on my own skills and continue with, with areas where I feel like there are lots of newer topics or newer ways to learn what this, you know, trade craft stuff moving forward.

[Kyser Clark]

Yeah, that makes sense. And I'm glad you brought up like teaching other people because I mean, it's common to say like, Oh yeah, you'll learn better if you teach other people. But I don't, I don't think people really understand like the actual value in that enough.

So what would you say to people who's just afraid to like get up on stage or afraid to make that YouTube video or, or do a demo or do that talk? What would you say to them?

[Trent Miller]

I would say you just have to do it. I recently spoke at CypherCon in Milwaukee, Wisconsin in April of this year. And I did a talk that was technical in nature and, and absolutely there are things in there that could have been wrong, but you, if you're afraid of that, you gotta, you gotta work through it.

You gotta, you know, do your talk and you'll always learn more later on. If you're scared of, you know, if you're scared of doing that maybe smaller group teaching just understand that everyone starts somewhere and you just have to plan to improve. There's no way to improve if you don't do it first.

[Kyser Clark]

That makes, yeah. Thanks for sharing that. And I was at a talk at DEF CON about how to talk, how to, how to do speeches.

And the presenter, man, I forget his name. Sorry for forgetting your name, but he asked a question. It was like, what, what are you afraid of when it comes to public speaking?

And I shouted out like in front of the crowd, I was like, I think I'm afraid of the audience or at least one person audience knowing more about my topic than I do. You know what I mean? Like, like you said, getting something wrong.

And still to this day, like, even though I have a lot of followers on LinkedIn and I still have, and I make a lot of YouTube content, content, heck you guys are listening to a podcast right now. And there's people that knows more than me and like, I still do it, but it's still in the back of my mind. Like, man, I hope I was able to deliver value or hope I'm not completely wrong.

But yeah, like you said, you just got to do it. And you know, if you're wrong, like it is what it is, like, cause you don't, no one knows everything about everything. And that's what I tell myself.

So it's like, as long as you are trying your best and you, if you're wrong, like just be willing to accept that you're wrong and learn from that.

[Trent Miller]

Absolutely. Yep. I, I can say with certainty, that is my biggest, my personal biggest fear.

And I'm sure that a lot of people also have that of being wrong, but you won't know you're wrong until you say it. But you absolutely can lean on, on the people that know more once you've, you know, went ahead and did what you needed to do first.

[Kyser Clark]

Great wisdom there. So Trent, we are running out of time. So I'm going to ask you the final question.

Here it is. So what is one key lesson you've learned recently in cybersecurity, or if you prefer, what's one bold prediction you have about the future of the field?

[Trent Miller]

I would say I'm going to go with the future of the field. I think as, as the last year has progressed, I've seen a lot of jobs go away for entry level. I would say that things are going to get very, very competitive.

And I believe that there's going to be a lot more people who are going to be interested in this field that are going to need to learn as well, that you need to hard, and you need to also understand that not everything is going to go directly into cybersecurity like you want. Step back. If you have to, don't be afraid to take that help desk role.

Don't be afraid to take that call center role because you'll get where you're going eventually, but keep that cybersecurity burning in your heart. It'll help you. But I think that things are going to get a as we see the progression of AI, like you mentioned but also with the current economy going the way that it is very unfortunate, things are going to get very difficult.

So just keep going.

[Kyser Clark]

That's great wisdom. And I'm trying to get in the habit of once the final wisdom was said, I'm not adding anything to it. I'm not going to add anything to it.

But if you want to unpack that audience, go back and listen to episode 20. Trent talks about why he took a step back to take a support role in Tenable and how it opened up more doors in his career later on. So if you're interested in that, go back and watch or listen to episode 20.

Trent, thank you so much for being here. Thanks for providing your expertise, your wisdoms and your insights. Where can the audience get ahold of you if they want to connect with you?

[Trent Miller]

Yeah, thanks for having me again. My name on Discord is AzureAD. You can find my GitHub at AzureADTrent.

And you can find me on LinkedIn if you would like to reach out and connect with me.

[Kyser Clark]

Hey audience, best place to reach me. Leave a YouTube comment and just ask your questions. I pay attention to my YouTube comments more than my LinkedIn DMs. If you send me a LinkedIn DM and I haven't replied back, sorry, I'm still getting caught up. But YouTube comments, I don't know, for some reason I'm just paying more attention to it. If you haven't already reviewed the show, if you're on audio, give the show a five star review. It would help the show out tremendously.

If you're on YouTube, hit the like button, hit the subscribe button. And regardless of what platform you're on, share the show with a friend. Cybersecurity is a lot better when you are sharing information with your friends.

So if you enjoy the show and you want someone else to be your cybersecurity buddy, then this is a good icebreaker for you. Thanks for watching. Thanks for listening.

Until next time, this is Kyser and Trent signing off.